Los Angeles, december 31, 1973 — morning walk

HIGHLIGHTS: Paper currency: cheaters and the cheated…gold standard is good because it discourages large scale industry and trade…real wealth as cattle and grains

 

 

Prajäpati: Actually, I was concerned this morning about inflation. The government and the newspapers, they say the biggest problem today is inflation. From our Kåñëa conscious standpoint, how can we cure this problem of inflation?

Prabhupäda: It is very simple. Don’t accept paper currency. It must be gold or some metal worth. Just like one dollar, it must be worth one dollar metal. Then it is solved. But they want to cheat. How it can be solved? Because if I pay you one dollar, I must pay you value for one dollar. But it is the cheating process is going on, “I pay you one dollar, a piece of paper. That’s all.” So you accept cheating, and I also cheat. Government allows. So how the problem can be solved? It is cheating. But the government allows it as law. And you accept, I accept. Then how they can be solved, solution? This is the solution.

 

 

Prajäpati: In the economy itself there isn’t actually enough money to, that’s even in the banks…Prabhupäda: That is cheating. Therefore I say cheating. I have no money. I give you simply paper. I promise to pay hundred dollars. What is the use of that promise if I have no money? But you want to be cheated. I cheat you. That’s all. You are satisfied of being cheated by me; so I take the advantage and I cheat you. I give you a paper. That’s all.

Bahuläçva: Real money is gold and silver.

Prabhupäda: Any… It must be value. According to the market price, it must be value. Whatever it may be.

Gold is taken, because gold is the most valuable metal. A small piece of gold, it can carry two hundred dollars. But if I give you iron, then you have to bring another, what is called, bus, to carry it. (laughter) So therefore gold standard is accepted everywhere. There is a standard price of gold, so when I pay you money, it must be, carry the value in gold. That’s all. Then there is no inflation. The people want to be cheated, and people cheat. That’s all.

Bahuläçva: In the Çrémad-Bhägavatam, Prabhupäda, you say that Kali became gold standardized.

Prabhupäda: That is another point. That one who has gold, he can purchase these four kinds of sinful activities: meat-eating, gambling, intoxication, illicit sex. If you have money, you can get illicit sex from big, big quarters. Is it not?

 

Karandhara: Yes.

Prabhupäda: Yes. The sinful activities have increased because the world has produced too much wealth. Because they can purchase sinful activities. And that is being increased by inflation. False money I have got, and with that false money I can purchase all this illicit sex, wine, intoxication, and… It is just like nowadays, bank is giving you a card, “Americard…” What is that?

Karandhara: Charge card. Bank Americard.

Prabhupäda: Ah. So you simply show the card, you get the goods. So to exchange, it has become very cheap. So cheaply you can purchase. Therefore cheaply you can purchase sinful things also. The people are becoming sinful. The modern economy is, “Engage people in hard working to produce, and by artificial cheating, secure the goods, commodities.” This is modern economy.

So a worker is getting three thousand dollar per month, but he is getting paper. But he is thinking that “I am getting money.” He is giving his labor, and things are being produced. This is the policy. “Cheat him. Without giving money, give him paper, and get his labor, and produce goods.” This is modern economy. Is it not? A laborer, a worker, is given high salary, high wages. So what he is getting? It is paper. And he is very enthusiastic to give his labor. So production is more. And when you go to purchase the products, then you have to pay again. Whatever you have earned, you have to pay everything, pay to the bank or pay to the man. Simply cheating process is going on…

Prajäpati: This is part of our platform. To even run for political office, we need solutions to the problems to offer as a platform. We will draw up various bills, ready for legislation, show them that we are serious.

Prabhupäda: So how you’ll present it? The cheating process is going on. Unless you become God conscious, the cheating process will not stop. So there is no solution.

Prajäpati: So therefore we introduce bill into the schools to introduce God consciousness to all the children there.

Prabhupäda: Yes. God consciousness. Then everyone will be honest, and everything will be adjusted. Everyone can understand this is pure cheating. I give you a hundred dollars, a piece of paper. That’s all. And you accept it. You want to be cheated. You thought, that “I have got now daily, hundred dollars. So let me work very hard.” He does not consider that “I am not getting a hundred dollars. I am getting a piece of paper.” So people have no brain to understand even. “This is not hundred dollars. Give me cash, hundred dollars.” Then everything, solution will be… There will be no inflation. Because I know that paying you a piece of paper, I can cheat you, therefore I am printing notes, to cheat so many people. Therefore inflation. But when there will be no possibility to cheat you, then there will be no inflation. Here I have got the opportunity, because I know that pushing forward a piece of paper, I can cheat so many people. So there must be inflation. Is it not? This is not psychological? If I know that I can cheat you by this instrument, so why shall I not increase that? That is inflation. What do you think, Karandhara?

Karandhara: That’s the basic principle, yes.

Prabhupäda: Yes. I am cheating you, and people accepting my cheating.

 

Karandhara: The governments actually started the whole thing. They instituted paper money and they instituted it because it is a cheating process. But everyone is participating. So it is just going on and on. That is the real cause of inflation.

Prabhupäda: Yes. That’s it. They are getting encouragement in their cheating business.

Bahuläçva: They won’t let you have any gold.

Prabhupäda: Now they have made law that you cannot store gold?

Karandhara: That’s been since 1933.

Prabhupäda: Just see.

Karandhara: Americans cannot own gold, store gold. Pretty soon they are going to pass the same law for silver.

Prabhupäda: Just see. Even they cannot have ornaments.

Karandhara: Well, you can have ornaments, jewelry.

Prabhupäda: So by law they are cheating. So how you can stop?

Karandhara: Now they have introduced a law that even the penny, which is the smallest denomination, it used to made out of copper, so now they are going to make it out of aluminum, because copper is too expensive.

Prabhupäda: Just see.

ahuläçva: It will be worth less than a penny when it is made out of aluminum.

Prabhupäda: Why not cement? (laughter) Because by law everything will be acceptable. Make it cement.

Bahuläçva: Çréla Prabhupäda, what can we do to curb down these rascals?

Prabhupäda: Chant Hare Kåñëa.

Bahuläçva: That will curb them down.

Prabhupäda: Yes. They will be purified. The more you chant Hare Kåñëa, they will be purified. This is… All problems are there on account of misunderstanding. What we are distributing? We are simply moving misunderstanding and bringing them to knowledge. This is our propaganda. So Mr. Theologician, is this suggestion appealing to you?

 

Prajäpati: It seems all right for ordinary dealings, Çréla Prabhupäda, having this money, what’s going on, but for large scale transactions it might be very difficult.

Prabhupäda: Huh?

Prajäpati: And as the practical basis, transactions of thousands and thousands of dollars, would be…

Prabhupäda: That will be good for the people. Because large scale transaction is there, therefore the capitalists hoarding. Capitalists hoarding. Goods are there, everything is there. You pay black price, you get it. Then, when somebody’s hoarding, he is not giving to the market. So if the large scale industry and trade becomes stopped, that is good for people.

Jagajjévana: Does that mean the same amount of gold is here?

Prabhupäda: No, larger scale… Suppose if you want to store, say, thousand kilos or a thousand bags of rice, so you have to pay me gold. But you have no such gold. Therefore large scale industry will be stopped. Just see.

Karandhara: Then the price of rice would go very low.

Prabhupäda: Yes. Then you get actual price and actual value. Goods are there, any part of the world you…, there is enough commodity. But these rascals, they are hoarding, and they are not giving in right time. So people are suffering.

Karandhara: Yes. There’s a… They buy now. They buy the goods before they are even grown, from the commodity market.

Prabhupäda: Yes, because they can pay in this paper, the bank will advance. So as soon as you… You have to introduce this metal coins, value. The whole cheating scheme will fail.

Jagajjévana: In the past there was a lot of gold on the planet. What has happened to it? There used to be a lot of gold on the planet?

Prabhupäda: Yes. They used as utensil, as household pots. Just like now you are advanced, using plastic, because you have become very advanced. So you are using plastic. They were using gold.

 

Jagajjévana: So what has happened to that gold?

Prabhupäda: What happened? If you keep utensil at home, what happens? You eat nicely on the plate. That’s all. Why you are concerned, what happening? It is in your store. That’s all. And gold is such a metal, any part of the country, any part of the world you go, you get immediately value.

Karandhara: Yes. Whenever there is an economic depression, then gold remains valuable. Just like when the stock market crashed in 1929, if you had gold you could still purchase goods. No matter how bad the economy was, people would accept gold as barter, but not currency.

 

Prabhupäda: Yes. Indian economy was that if you have got extra money, you get gold ornament for your wife. So then your money is stocked there. Or purchase some utensils, silver utensils. That was Indian economy. This depositing in the bank and thinking that I am getting good interest, that is another cheating. It is another cheating. If things are not available, what will you get by getting interest? Therefore I am advising that purchase land and produce our own food. There will be no problem.

 

 

Karandhara: The inflation rate is higher than the interest rate. If you earn 5 3/4 % interest in a year, the inflation has gone up 6% in a year. So actually your money, at best it’s kept the same.

 

Prabhupäda: The money is to be kept in cattle and grains. That is Indian economy, cattle and grains. If you have got many cows, you get milk. Milk preparation. And if you have got grain, then where is your problem? You prepare your foodstuff at home and eat and chant Hare Kåñëa. Where is your problem? You want to eat and live peacefully. So if you have got grains and milk, you have got enough food and there is no problem. You haven’t got to go fifty miles for your work, and then you require a tin car. So many problems. But if you get your food at home, then eat them and chant Hare Kåñëa and go back to home, back to Godhead. Simple thing.

Prajäpati: So many people now employed in sinful activities, jobs that are to do with sinful life. If we get rid of these sinful activities, what will we find for these people to do to replace their jobs?

Prabhupäda: Do pious activities. Do you mean to say we have to continue sinful activities for their job? (laughter)

Prajäpati: They say like that.

Prabhupäda: No, we shall give engagement.

Prajäpati: Cattle industry, liquor industry, tobacco industry, all these big industries.

Prabhupäda: Yes. Let them be without industry. Come to us. We shall give them food. Yes. Just like that… What is that? Mågäri, Mågäri. He was thinking that “Unless I kill animals, how I will eat, I shall live?” And Närada gave him, that “I will give you to eat. Come here.” So he became Vaiñëava. So that is our propaganda.” Stop this nonsense business. If you think that ‘How you shall eat?’ I shall give you eating. Come on. “This is our program.” First of all you stop it. Then I will, see how I will give you.” Just see. When I came first I was alone. I had no shelter, no food. And how we are maintaining now thousands of people, and giving them to eat, and nice shelter? How it is possible? It is possible. Because after all, Kåñëa gives everything. So if they become Kåñëized, everything will come. Why they bother about the sinful activities?

 

VÅNDÄVANA, MARCH 12, 1974 — VARËÄÇRAMA WALK

 

HIGHLIGHTS: Every ISKCON center should be a varëäçrama college…leaders must engage every person and every resource properly… varëäçrama management will end unemployment and famine.

 

 

Prabhupäda: …[The politicians’] business will be to exploit the poor citizens. And they will be embarrassed and harassed so much: by one side, no sufficient rain, and therefore scarcity of food, and the other side, taxation by the government. In this way, the people will be so much harassed that they’ll give up their home and go to the forest. Very [pitiful]… Unless they take to Kåñëa consciousness, they’ll not be saved. The varëäçrama college has to be established immediately. Everywhere, wherever we have got our center, a varëäçrama college should be established to train four divisions: one class, brähmaëa; one class, kñatriya; one class, vaiçya; and one class, çüdra. But everyone will be elevated to the spiritual platform by the spiritual activities which we have prescribed. There is no inconvenience, even for the çüdras.

Passerby: Jayo!

Prabhupäda: Hare Kåñëa.

Bhagavän: Are çüdras supposed to take sannyäsa also?

Prabhupäda: No, why?

Bhagavän: Çüdras…

Prabhupäda: Those who are çüdras, they should not be allowed to take sannyäsa. Only those who are qualified brähmaëas, they’ll be allowed to take sannyäsa.

Bhagavän: Kñatriyas used to take sannyäsa too?

Prabhupäda: Kñatriyas… Some of them. Not all.

Guru däsa: Yudhiñöhira Mahäräja?

Prabhupäda: Eh?

Guru däsa: Yudhiñöhira Mahäräja.

Prabhupäda: They did not take sannyäsa, but they left home. There is no need of accepting sannyäsa. One has to perform the devotional activities. That is real thing. Simply by changing dress, one does not improve. Unless he takes to the, seriously, principles of devotional service. But in the Kali-yuga, they’ll think, “Because I have changed my dress, I have become a big sannyäsé.” You see? “Because I have got a sacred thread, now I am a brähmaëa.” No. There must be regular training. Hare Kåñëa.

Jagadéça: Çréla Prabhupäda, in a varëäçrama society is…

 

Prabhupäda: Eh?

Jagadéça: In a varëäçrama society, are most of the citizens çüdras?

Prabhupäda: Eh?

Jagadéça: Are the majority of citizens çüdras? In a varëäçrama society?

Prabhupäda: Yes. The number of çüdras are always bigger. Just like in university education. The, the number of graduates and post-graduates, they’re less. Others are big, number bigger.

Bhagavän: The whole idea is that at the end of everyone’s life, everyone is required to leave home, perform devotional activities, but not necessarily take sannyäsa.

Prabhupäda: Devotional activities, either he leaves from home or not leaves, that doesn’t matter. It must continue from the very beginning. For the management of affairs, we require to divide. Because there are different classes of brain, so those who have very intellectual brain, they should become brähmaëas.

 

Those who are fit for management and protection, they should be trained as kñatriya. And those who are fit for producing food, taking care of the cows, they should be trained as vaiçya. And the balance, they’re all çüdras. This is the division. You…

Everywhere you’ll find this division, natural. One class of men, very intelligent. One class of men, very strong, good brain for management, administration. (aside) Jaya. One class of men, fit for tilling the ground, field, and produce food, take care of the cows. And the balance, çüdra. That’s all. So in our society, this division should be there. The most intelligent class of men, they should be engaged in preaching, reading books and instructing, taking care of Deity worship, temple, and another class should be strong managers, that things are going on nicely. Everyone is engaged, not that eating and sleeping. Everyone must be engaged, employed.

 

So, so if one is very much adapted for eating and sleeping, he should be engaged with plows. You see. He must be activity. Otherwise, there must be dysentery, eating and sleeping. He cannot digest. Yes. So in this way, our society should be managed. Not that “Give me second initiation, a sacred thread.” And after getting it, business finished: “Now I’m liberated.

et me eat and sleep.” This should be stopped. We have got fifty bighäs of land, and I have calculated in Mäyäpura, setting aside twenty bighäs for the temple and grazing ground for the cows, thirty bighäs of land. The production should be three hundred mounds of grains. And three hundred mounds of grain, I have calculated. How much you can…?

Bhagavän: Fifteen hundred.

 

Prabhupäda: No. According to our present calculated, about 180 mounds. So there should be 120 mounds excess of grain. Instead of excess, they want ten thousand rupees for maintenance. This is… This management is going on. These things were not discussed in GBC? So what kind of discussion was there? Simply talking? No practical? And the estimate of budget was presented for ten thousand rupees per month. And…

 

And when it was scrutinizingly studied, immediately it came down to six thousand. So what kind of budget? So management should be in that way, that nobody is sitting idly. Automatically he’ll fall sick. Sickness means idleness. Or excess eating, sleeping. No excess, no less. Yuktähära-vihärasya yogo bhavati duùkha-hä. [Bg 6.17: “He who is regulated in his habits of eating, sleeping, recreation and work can mitigate all material pains by practicing the yoga system.”] Yukta. Yukta means actually what you need. (aside:) Hare Kåñëa. So everywhere, in each center, this system should be introduced, and there must be practical application of the varëäçrama. At the same time, this program of devotional service. Then it will go on very nicely.

 

 

Hådayänanda: Should devotees be formally designated in a particular occupation?

Prabhupäda: Eh? No. Devotees are devotees. Actually devotees are above this brähmaëa, kñatriya, vaiçya, çüdra. But for management of material things, we have to divide. Just like in the body there are divisions. There are… Kåñëa. Kåñëa was acting as a kñatriya. In His boyhood, He was acting like a vaiçya. But Kåñëa is neither kñatriya nor, nor brähmaëa. This is the example. He was a cowherd boy. That is business of vaiçya. And when He was fighting in the battlefield, He was a kñatriya. He was marrying as a kñatriya. So although He was acting sometimes as kñatriya, sometimes as vaiçya, but He’s neither of these. So devotee is like that. He may act in any position, but He is above all the material conception of life. That is perfection. Hare Kåñëa, Hare Kåñëa…

 

Nitäi: Çréla Prabhupäda?…What should the kñatriyas be taught?

Prabhupäda: Kñatriyas should be taught that he is manager. He must see that everyone is engaged. And if there is any fight, they must come forward to fight. This is kñatriya’s business. There may be fight. Somebody may attack us. Not that chanting, “Hare Kåñëa Hare Kåñëa Kåñëa Kåñëa…” No. They must come forward. “Yes, we are prepared to fight.” That is kñatriya.

Tamäla-Kåñëa: Prabhupäda?…In our centers we are awarding brähmaëa initiation, second initiation…

 

 

Prabhupäda: No, no. Initiation should go on. Even… You do not under stand what I have said, that that is for Vaiñëava. A Vaiñëava and Viñëu… Just like Kåñëa is Viñëu, He’s not human being, but He was acting like human being, similarly, Vaiñëava is transcendental. But for proper management of the material world, one should be acting like brähmaëa, one should be acting like kñatriya. That is required. Just like actually we are doing so. Some of you are preaching, and some of you are cleansing the temple. It does not mean that a sannyäsé who is preaching, he is better than that man who is cleansing. The… Their position as Vaiñëava is the same. But for the management, one is cleansing, one is seeing the construction, one is going to preach, like that. That should be there. It is not that “Because I have taken sannyäsa, therefore I cannot any more do any thing.” If need be, he has to act as kñatriya. Or a çüdra. It doesn’t matter.

 

Hådayänanda: Oh.

Prabhupäda: Doesn’t matter. But manage, for management, this division must be there. Otherwise it will be mismanagement. Yes. A Vaiñëava coming to the position of doing the work of a çüdra does not mean he has become çüdra. He’s Vaiñëava. Try to understand this point. Just like in the stage. If you want to play something, one must be king, one must be queen, one must be…, but neither of them king or queen. That is stage play. Similarly to manage things in the material world we have to… Guëa, karma. Karma there must be. Therefore the karma should be done, executed, according to quality.

 

Ätreya-åñi: So in our Movement, the leaders must decide how every devotee and every resource is engaged properly.

Prabhupäda: That is leadership. That is leadership: Which man is fitted for which work.

 

Ätreya-åñi: Yes. Utilization of all resources…

Prabhupäda: Yes.

Ätreya-åñi: …including devotees and funds and everything.

Prabhupäda: Then… The first thing is that we should see that everyone is engaged. How he should be engaged, that requires leadership. But the first business is to engage everyone. Nobody should be without engagement. Then it will be idle worse, works… What do you call? Idle brain is devil’s workshop. And the devil is käminé-käïcana, woman and money. This is devil. So if you remain idle, then you shall think of devil. So we should see that everyone is engaged properly. Hare Kåñëa. Jaya. (break) …instruction in this connection is very important. Everyone should be trained as Vaiñëava. At the same time, he should work in different position for management. So if our men are not prepared—Tamäla Kåñëa Mahäräja— for doing the plowing work, then what is the use of purchasing land?

 

Tamäla Kåñëa: They are not prepared.

Prabhupäda: Eh?

Tamäla Kåñëa: They are not prepared.

Prabhupäda: Then? You have to engage laborer and spend two hundred rupees per head at least, including salary and food, and the production is nil. In this way, there must be ten thousand, twenty thousand expenditure. Am I right or not, that “You bring money some way from anywhere, and let us spend lavishly?” What kind of management this is? We should consider the money, after all, is earned with hard labor. So somebody will bring money with hard labor, and another body will spend like irresponsible prince; that should be stopped. That is management. (break) …especially is that the religion means to make a class of men, simply idle… What is? Opiate…? What is called?

 

 

Devotees: Opiate of the people.

Prabhupäda: Therefore they are against religion. But actually, if we show that we are producing, we are managing, we are educating, then we can counteract the communist tendency. But they are seeing that, that escaping. They say, “They escape responsibility of worldly life and they’re indulging in some religious…” That is the tendency. All… Everywhere the government is complaining like that. Therefore they do not want to increase the number of temples, increase the number of devotees. They do not want. Because they say, “These are a class of idle men. They cannot do anything, and they take to this religious life.” That is the tendency. They are feeling like that.

 

 

But if you show that you are actually doing something ideal, then they will appreciate. Make a small unit of community and show ideal life, not idle life. Ideal life. Then this mis… That… Now in Bombay, they have refused. Because they are under the impression that “They, these Europeans have come here under some sentiment, and what is the use?” They have taken some plea and rejected our… (break) …is there. As we are making counter-propaganda against mäyä, the mäyä is also very strong. She will also make propaganda against you, very strong. So unless you become very sincere devotee, daivé hy eñä guëamayé mama mäyä duratyayä [Bg. 7.14]—then it will not be possible to conquer over mäyä. You’ll be succumbed. Hare Kåñëa. (break)…

daivé hy eñä guëa-mayé

mama mäyä duratyayä

mäm eva ye prapadyante

mäyäm etäà taranti te

[Bg. 7.14]

 

 

[Bg 7.14: “This divine energy of Mine, consisting of the three modes of material nature, is difficult to overcome. But those who have surrendered unto Me can easily cross beyond it.”] In India, the brähmaëa class, they say, “Oh, I am born in brähmaëa family. Why shall I do this work?” You see.

 

Therefore the whole society has gone to hell. In your country still, they accept any kind of work. It doesn’t matter. And here, in India, if he happens to be a brähmaëa, he’ll not take any kind of work. Means… Just like plowing. He’ll not agree. Therefore so much land. The kñatriya is thinking, “I am kñatriya.” The brähmaëa is thinking, “I am brähmaëa.” And the land is lying fallow. There is no production. He will go to the office and fight with the pen as a kñatriya. And instead of studying Vedas, he’ll study the rules and regulations given by the office. But he’ll not come to plow. Therefore this scarcity of food. He’ll go to a mill to work as ordinary laborer. (Hindi) He’ll not come. So much land we see lying unutilized. And they’re crying for grain. Why? The same example. I was writing that in New York City, the whole city is full of dirty things, garbage, for want of cleaners, and you go to the Central Park, you’ll find so many hippies are lying down idle.

Ätreya-åñi: Unemployment.

Prabhupäda: Unem… Not employment. They’ll not work. That means mismanagement. Why they should remain down? Why they should remain without any employment? But the government is not doing that.

Devotee: They do not feel inspired.

Prabhupäda: Eh?

Devotee: They do not feel inspired. No one has desire.

 

Prabhupäda: That, that means mismanagement. You had no desire to take to Kåñëa consciousness, but you have been taken to it by some, some way or other. That is management.

Hådayänanda: Jaya, Prabhupäda.

Prabhupäda: That is management.

Hådayänanda: You are expert manager.

 

 

Prabhupäda: A child does not want to go to school, but it is the duty of the parent to send him to the school by some way or other. So that is govern ment’s duty, that a man should be employed according to his capacity. There should be no unemployment. That is very dangerous position of the society. Now this unemployment question is very strong all over the world. They’ll plan that “This government is not good. That system is not good. He’s not good.” And he’ll do nothing. He’ll personally do nothing. Just like the hippies, they criticize everyone, but he’ll not do anything. It is all… These descriptions are there in the Çrémad-Bhägavatam. We are going too far? Employed… (break) …from the government to utilize this land. You see? So much. Everywhere you’ll find. Everywhere you’ll find. Who was with me in London?

Devotee: Yeah. Last time, last summer?

Prabhupäda: Letchmore Heath.

Devotee: Yeah?

Prabhupäda: So much, lying vacant. They have taken it into consideration that “What is the use of working in the land? Better kill one animal and eat easily.” Because he doesn’t care for sinful activities. The… “If I can eat the cow, why shall I take so much trouble to till the…?” This is going on, all over the world.

 

 

Indian man: Employment means now just to cut the money and not to work. No work.

Prabhupäda: Yes. (break) The same… Employment, even for the woman, the carakä. You see? Gandhi also studied this. There must be… Woman should be engaged for weaving. What is called?

Devotee: Spinning.

Prabhupäda: Spinning, yes. Everyone should be engaged. That is manage ment. So all GBC members must see that in every temple, everyone is engaged.

Brahmänanda: That is the meaning of leadership.

Prabhupäda: That is the meaning of leadership.

Hådayänanda: And that all the devotees are protected.

Prabhupäda: Eh?

Hådayänanda: And all the devotees are protected.

 

 

Prabhupäda: Yes. Everyone should be engaged. And if everyone is engaged, he’ll never fall sick. Yes. (break) …the farmers, their son, they’re giving up the farming business.

Haàsadüta: Going to the city.

Prabhupäda: Going to the city. In your country also?

Ätreya-åñi: Yes, Çréla Prabhupäda.

Prabhupäda: Or you have nothing to do with farming.

Ätreya-åñi: Excuse me?

Prabhupäda: Your country, there is nothing to do with farming. You have got petrol.

Ätreya-åñi: No. No there is a lot of good land, but they’re not developing it.

Devotee: Just selling petrol.

Prabhupäda: Yes. Yes, if they can get money underground, “Why shall I work?” (end)

 

 

VÅNDÄVANA, MARCH 14, 1974 — VARËÄÇRAMA WALK

 

HIGHLIGHTS: All work for Krsna is transcendental because it furthers His preaching mission; there is no distinction of higher and lower between service of the different varëas …real business for a vaiçya means produce grains, eat and distribute…brähmaëas should become expert in every kind of knowledge

 

 Prabhupäda: …If it comes to the notice of the government that [we’re] maintaining ourselves by production of food, they’ll like very much…

 

Devotee: Feeding…

Bhagavän: …The society would go to the gurukula, and there it would be decided what their work would be?

Prabhupäda: Yes. First of all there should be an instructor on the spiritual life, then according to his position… Our spiritual life is meant, we should always remember… But for management we have to make divisions. That is…

 

Devotee: Actually the whole society could be Vaiñëava.

Prabhupäda: Ah. They’re Vaiñëava. But because they have got to live in the material world, there must be division of work. If everyone wants to become the brain, who will act as leg? That is also required. If everyone says, “No, no, I’m not going to do the work of leg. I want simply to work as…” No. It is needed. The brain is needed, the hand is needed, the belly is needed, the leg is needed. So that we have to divide. Who will work as brain, who will work as hand, who will work as leg…The main aim is how to maintain this body perfectly, fit. That should be the aim, how the society will go on nicely. And for management, this hand, leg, brain, belly must be divided. Just like there’s slight difference, those who are directly engaged in temple worship and those who are going to sell books. Apparently there’s difference, but basically there is no difference. Like that. If one can sell books nicely, why he should be, I mean to say, engaged in the temple worship? He can do better work in that way. But there is no difference between selling the books and temple worship. Or washing the dish. There’s no difference, because it is all transcendental.

 

 

 

 

Just like aìgäni yasya sakalendriya-våttimanti. [Brahma Samhita 5.32: “He has all the potencies of all the senses in all parts of His transcendental body.”] Kåñëa’s hands and legs, there’s no difference. You’ve read this verse?

Haàsadüta: Yes, aìgäni yasya sakalendriya…

Prabhupäda: But still leg and hand.

Madhudviña: Çréla Prabhupäda?

Prabhupäda: Hm.

Madhudviña: Kåñëa says, Ya idaà paramaà guhyam [Bg 18.68].

Prabhupäda: Hm.

Madhudviña: He says [Bg 18.68]: “Those who repeat this message of Bhagavad-gétä, are most dear friends to me, and there’s no one more dear to Me than he…”

Prabhupäda: Hm.

Madhudviña: Wouldn’t that indicate that a preacher is higher than a worker?

Prabhupäda: Yes, this is preaching, this is preaching. You help. Suppose you are preaching, and if I help you… Just like I’m preaching, you’re helping. You are also preaching.

Ätreya Åñi: Also this building is preaching.

Prabhupäda: This is also preaching. So it is not that preaching means simply talking. Preaching means everything. The construction is also preaching. The designing is also preaching. Everything is… Otherwise what is the use of spending so much money if it is not preaching?

 

 

Devotee: Jaya.

Haàsadüta: Yeah. (break) Everything that has to do with propagating Kåñëa…

Prabhupäda: Yes.

Haàsadüta: …in any way.

Prabhupäda: That is preaching. Just like… Nava-vidhä-bhakti [Madhya 15.107: “Nine process of devotional service”]:

çravaëaà kértanaà viñëoù

smaraëaà päda-sevanam

arcanaà vandanaà däsyaà

sakhyam ätma-nivedanam

 [SB 7.5.23]

[SB 7.5.23: “Hearing and chanting about the transcendental holy name, form, qualities, paraphernalia and pastimes of Lord Viñëu, remembering them, serving the lotus feet of the Lord, offering the Lord respectful worship with sixteen types of paraphernalia, offering prayers to the Lord, becoming His servant, considering the Lord one’s best friend, and surrendering everything unto Him (in other words, serving Him with the body, mind and words)—these nine processes are accepted as pure devotional service.”]

They’re all perfect, but it appears çravaëa, hearing, is different from kértana. Or kértana is different from smaraëam or päda-sevanam or arcanam. But they’re all perfect. So one should be engaged either in çravaëam, kértanam, smaraëam—as he’s fit. This is the… Suppose I cannot speak, kértanam, but I can hear. That is as perfect. Ah? Çravaëaà kértanaà viñëoù. So one may argue that “Speaking is better than hearing.” No. Both ways, either hearing or speaking, they’re the same thing. Because it is for Kåñëa. Çravaëaà kértanaà viñëoù [SB 7.5.23]. In our society every work is transcendental: for preaching. Every work. But one must be engaged with some work.

 

 

 

Нàsadüta: That’s important…

Prabhupäda: That is important. Otherwise every work is preaching. See that everyone is engaged.

There was an advertisement by the railroad department, their monogram was a wheel of carriage and they have written that every employee of the railroad should see that the wheel is running on. Wheel is running on. Now suppose in the office the clerks are working, so how they will see the wheel is running on? Because in the office of railway there is some complaint, there is some claim, there so many things… But that is depending on their wheel. So they should expedite their business so that wheel may not stop, it must go on. It is very nice instruction. So the wheel is going on.

 

 

Suppose some station has asked for ten wagons immediately, and that requires the sanction of the divisional superintendent. That is his office. So the clerk should help the progress that immediately the sanction is done. Then the wheel will go on. Do you understand? So everyone can help that the railway wheel is going on. Although apparently it will appear that “What this clerk has to do with the wheel going on?” Is it clear?

 

 

Bhagavän: So there’s so much to do in Kåñëa’s service, everyone can be engaged in some…

Prabhupäda: Yes, that everyone should know…

Suppose one is engaged in cooking prasädam. You should see that nice prasädam is served to the worker, quickly, so they can take prasädam, be healthy and go on preaching. So he is helping preaching by cooking. Just like you are working and the brain is also working, “Go this side, go that side, the car is coming.” Brain says, the… “Leg, come this side.” Everyone is working. The leg is working, the brain is working, the hand is working, the tongue is working. But the business of the tongue and business of the leg is different. The aim being, the central point being Kåñëa, to help, to serve Him, then everything is work, absolute. The Mäyävädé philosophers, they cannot understand it. They think that “Kåñëa is working like ordinary man. How He can become God? It is mäyä. Therefore Kåñëa is also mäyä.” Therefore we called them Mäyävädé.

 

 

Bhagavän: A leader must be very expert so that people would be happy in their engagement.

Prabhupäda: Everyone should be expert. The leaders must be expert and the worker must be expert so that they may follow the instruction of the leader. If the leader says something and the workers, “Hm, I shall consider it, later on,” then how the leader will execute his leadership? Both of them should be cooperating and know that “We are all working for Kåñëa.”

 

Ätreya Åñi: …We are not lazy like Mäyävädés.

Prabhupäda: Yeah. Ahaà brahmäsmi. “I have become now Brah man—stop work. Eat and make your belly…” You see how Mäyävädé sannyäsé… Ah. (Prabhupäda gestures; devotees laugh) They think that “Now I have become Brahman, I have nothing to do. (Prabhupäda laughs) I have become Näräyaëa.” “If you’ve got nothing to do, then why you are eating?” And for one cäpäöi you’ll find there are many Mäyävädés. They’re busy simply collecting cäpäöis. (devotees laugh)

 

 

VÅNDÄVANA MARCH 14, 1974— MORNING WALK

 

 

HIGHLIGHTS: Gurukula… for the small children… grown up…varëäçrama school, four principles essential…women… don’t attend varëäçrama college…First of all varëa… then äçrama..

 

VARËÄÇRAMA COLLEGE

Prabhupäda: …technological college. Similarly, this is another college, varëäçrama college.

Satsvarüpa: For the public in general?

Prabhupäda: Eh? Yes. Anyone. Just like engineering college is open for anyone. He must be ready to take up the training. Similarly, this varëäçrama college, he must be ready, the student, must be ready to take up the training.

Hådayänanda: Would it be for a particular age group?

Prabhupäda: Yes, any education, from childhood. Yes. Education means from childhood. Hare Kåñëa. Kaumära äcaret präjïo dharmän bhägavatän iha. [SB 7.6.1]: “One who is sufficiently intelligent should use the human form of body from the very beginning of life—in other words, from the tender age of childhood—to practice the activities of devotional service…”] The… How… We are getting so many sannyäsés, they should teach. Teaching should be done by the sannyäsés. Just like in missionary school, the fathers teaches.

 

Hådayänanda: How would it be different than gurukula?

Prabhupäda: Eh?

Hådayänanda: How would it differ from gurukula?

Prabhupäda: Gurukula is only for the small children. Preliminary, primary. And when the children are grown up, they should be sent to the varë äçrama school or college for further developed training.

 

Hådayänanda: They should… Should they be taught also some… Should there also be teaching in some particular skill or varëa? Such as say…

 

Prabhupäda: No.

 

Hådayänanda: Say, for example, someone was a, a kñatriya by inclination, or a…?

 

Prabhupäda: No, inclination can be changed also. If one has got little ad… But we should take little advantage of the inclination. Not that… That is to be decided by the… Inclination or no inclination, we can… That will be done. That is not very difficult. This is a most important item. Because people have been spoiled all over the world by being misguided by the so-called leaders. Therefore varëäçrama college is required. Hare Kåñëa.

 

 

Hådayänanda: But Prabhupäda, I’m still not quite clear. In other words, we’d teach, for example, like Bhagavad-gétä and Çrémad-Bhägavatam.

 

Prabhupäda: Yes. Hare Kåñëa. Jaya. Eh?

 

Hådayänanda: How much would be expected of the students as far as…? Would they live with us and follow the four principles? Like that? Or just come for classes or…?

 

Prabhupäda: Yes. Come to classes you won’t get. Because nobody has got any taste for such thing. A boarding school or boarding college would…

 

 

Hådayänanda: Boarding school.

 

Prabhupäda: Yes.

 

Hådayänanda: And there should… Should there be any material subject matters taught like in gurukula?

 

Prabhupäda: Yes. Just like material subject matter, kñatriya, or the brähmaëas, kñatriya, as they are described in the Bhagavad-gétä, what are the symptoms of brähmaëa, what is the symptoms of kñatriya. The kñatriyas should be taught how to fight also. There will be military training. There will be training how to kill.

 

Hådayänanda: Oh.

 

Prabhupäda: Yes. And vaiçyas should be trained how to give protection to the cows, how to till the field and grow food. Practical.

 

Nitäi: Not business also?

 

Prabhupäda: Eh?

 

Nitäi: The vaiçyas?

 

Prabhupäda: Business, this rascal business, no.

 

Nitäi: No?

 

Prabhupäda: Business means if you have got extra grains or extra foodstuff, you can sell where there is necessity, there is want. That is business. We are not going to open mills and factories and… No. We are not going to do that. That is çüdra business. The real business is that you produce enough food grains, as much as possible, and you eat and distribute. That’s all. This is business. He does not require any so high technical education. Anyone can till the ground and grow food. Is it difficult? This is the business.

 

The first thing is that everyone, man and animal, especially the cows, they must be properly fed so become very stout and strong. Cows will supply milk, and man will work hard, without being suffered by dysentery. He must work hard. Any capacity. Work as a teacher or work as a kñatriya, work as a ploughman. Or work as general assistant. He must work. Everyone should be employed. And his employment will be provided from any of these groups, according to his capacity. Either as a brähmaëa, or as a kñatriya, or as a vaiçya, or as a çüdra.

 

 

 

Hådayänanda: What kind of training is there for a çüdra?

Prabhupäda: Çüdra is general assistant.

Hådayänanda: Oh, just…

Prabhupäda: Order-carrier. He has no intelligence. He doesn’t require intelligence. “Do this.” That’s all.

Satsvarüpa: What would he learn at the school, though?

Prabhupäda: Eh?

Satsvarüpa: What would his business be at that varëäçrama college?

Prabhupäda: Yes. That is also training, to become obedient. Because people are not obedient. What are these hippies? They are not obedient. So obedience also require training. If you have no intelligence, if you cannot do anything independently, just be obedient to the other, higher three classes. That is çüdra. He must agree to abide by the orders of brähmaëa, kñatriyas, vaiçya. That’s all. So that nobody will be unemployed. Everyone should be trained up to sleep six to eight hours and attend meeting, chant, and ärati. And balance—he must work hard. Not that sleeping unlimitedly. There is no limit.

 

 

 

 

Yaduvara: Çréla Prabhupäda?

Prabhupäda: Yes.

Yaduvara: What class does the arts and crafts come under?

Prabhupäda: Eh? Çüdra.

Yaduvara: Çüdra.

Prabhupäda: They are çüdras. Little arts and crafts can be trained up to the çüdras. They, at the present moment, they have given too much stress on the arts and crafts.

 

Yaduvara: Hm. Yes.

Prabhupäda: Therefore the whole people, population, is çüdra.

 

Hådayänanda: It is a fact.

 

Prabhupäda: That is a… That is the difficulty. All people are being drawn by giving them, I mean to say, attraction for high salary, and they are taking so-called technical education, and all of them working in the factory. Nobody’s working on the field. They are çüdras. (break)

 

 

Hådayänanda: …artist is accepted as a philosopher in life.

Prabhupäda: Eh?

 

Hådayänanda: In our society (break) …accepted (break) …as a philosopher.

 

Prabhupäda: Artist?

 

Hådayänanda: Yeah, the artist.

 

Prabhupäda: No, no. Artist is also business of the çüdra.

 

 

Hådayänanda: Yes, but in our… I’m saying, in modern society in America, they are considered… (break)

 

Prabhupäda: Nonsense philosophy. They do not know what is the meaning of philosophy.

 

Hådayänanda: Yes.

 

Prabhupäda: That, in your Western countries the rascals, they are writing philosophy on sex life, which is known by the dog…They’re all less than çüdras. So a Freud has become a philosopher. Vane haye çågäla räjä. “In the jungle, the jackal has become a king.” That’s all. What is knowledge there? It is that… The whole western world is going on for industry, for making money, eat, drink, be merry, wine and women. That’s… They’re all less than çüdras and caëòälas. This is the first time attempt is being made to make them human beings. Don’t mind. I am using very strong words. That is the fact.

 

Hådayänanda: It’s true. Yes.

 

Prabhupäda: Otherwise, they are little animals with four hand, two legs, two hand, hand animals. That’s all. Yes. Rejected them. Vedic civilization rejected them, mlecchas and yavanas. But they can be reformed. The process is the same. Not that because they are rejected, they cannot be reclaimed. They can be reclaimed also. Just like you are being done. Although you are coming from the mlecchas and yavanas, by training, you are becoming more than a brähmaëa. So there is no bar for them. Unfortunately, these rascals do not agree to accept. As soon as you say, “No more illicit sex,” oh, they become angry. As soon as I say, “There is no meat-eating,” they become angry. Mürkhäyopadeço hi prakopayati na çamayati (?). The rascals, fools, if you give them good lessons, education, they will be angry. Prakopayati na çamayati. Payaù pänaà bhujaìgänäm (?). The snake, if you give him nice milk and banana, the result will be he will increase his poison. Payaù pänaà bhujaìgänäà kevalaà viña- vardhanam.

 

 

But Kåñëa’s grace, Caitanya Mahäprabhu’s grace, they are being now trained up. Now you be trained up and revise the whole edition of the western civilization, especially in America. Then a new chapter will come in. This is the program. Therefore varëäçrama school required.

 

Hådayänanda: So Prabhupäda, in this varëäçrama college, is it true that there will be no need, for example, for teaching material history and mathematics and…?

 

 

Prabhupäda: No, there is no need. History, we simply read Mahäbhärata, history of the great men, Päëòavas, how they were fighting for the good cause, how they were reigning. That history. Not this rascal history. If you study that history millions of years, what is that history and what you’ll learn from that history? You learn history of the really great men, how they worked, how they ruled. That is a… You study history of Mahäräja Yudhiñöhira.

 

 

Hådayänanda: Mahäbhärata.

 

Prabhupäda: Study the history of Mahäräja Parékñit. That is required. Not that simply chronological record, all nonsense, and big, big books, and making research. Why should you waste your time in that way?

 

 

Hådayänanda: Jaya. Yes. And so…

 

 

Prabhupäda: Hm? History must be for great person. This is history.

 

 

Hådayänanda: So in our varëäçrama college the students that come to our college, they follow the four principles… They follow…

 

Prabhupäda: Four principles essential. Essential. But only the çüdras or the kñatriyas… Just like kñatriyas, they have to learn how to kill. So practically, they should go to the forest and kill some animal. And if he likes, he can eat also. If he likes, he can eat also.

 

 

Hådayänanda: What he kills.

 

Prabhupäda: Yes. But not from the slaughterhouse. Those who are kñatriyas, they can, they’re allowed sometimes to eat meat. It is understood Bhéma, Bhéma also eating sometimes meat. Bhéma. Amongst the Päëòavas, only Bhéma. Not others. So if the kñatriyas, they want to eat meat, they can be allowed on particular occasions. But they must go to the forest and kill the animal. Not that for meat-eating regular slaughterhouses should be maintained. This is all nonsense, degradation. If you want to eat meat, you go to the forest. And the çüdras, they also sometimes eat meat. Or the caëòälas.

 

Hådayänanda: But never the cow.

 

Prabhupäda: No. Cow… The çüdras, they can take a goat and sacrifice before the deity, goddess Kälé, and then eat. Nobody should be given unrestricted freedom to eat meat. Or wine. If one is adamant to drink wine, then there is Caëòé-püjä, Durgä-püjä. That means restriction. That means restriction. Under certain condition. Similarly, sex life—marriage. That is also sex life, but under condition.

 

 

Satsvarüpa: Çréla Prabhupäda, is this school for women also, or just for men?

Prabhupäda: For men. Women should automatically learn how to cook, how to cleanse home.

Satsvarüpa: So they don’t attend varëäçrama college.

Prabhupäda: No, no. Varëäçrama college especially meant for the brähmaëa, kñatriya and vaiçya. Those who are not fit for education, they are çüdras. That’s all. Or those who are reluctant to take education—çüdra means. That’s all. They should assist the higher class.

 

 

Hådayänanda: Would the brähmaëas learn Sanskrit?

 

Prabhupäda: Eh? Not necessarily.

 

Hådayänanda: Not necessarily. Just more philosophy.

 

Prabhupäda: Just like I am translating all the books, similarly, any book of knowledge can be translated into different languages. Not that one has to learn Sanskrit.

 

Hådayänanda: So in this varëäçrama college there would be two divisions, varëa and äçr… Learning a materia…

 

 

 Prabhupäda: First of all varëa. And äçrama, then, when the varëa is perfectly in order, then äçrama. Äçrama is specially meant for spiritual advancement, and varëa is general division. It must be there in the human society, or they’re on the animals. If varëa is not there, then this is a society of animal. And when the varëa is working perfectly, then we give them äçrama. Varëäçrama. That is later on.

 

 

 

 

Hådayänanda: First they should be taught a skill.

 

Prabhupäda: Yes. First of all, the whole society must be divided into four varëas. Otherwise, there will be chaotic condition. That is what is the position now. What is he, what he has to do, one does not know. And there are so many unemployment. But if you organize the society into varëas, there will be no question of unemployment.

 

Hådayänanda: But from the very beginning there should be taught Bhagavad-gétä and…

 

Prabhupäda: Yes. But our, our position is that we are above varëäçrama. But for management or ideal society, we are introducing this. We, so far we are concerned, Kåñëa conscious men, we are above varëäçrama.

But to show the people that we are not escaping, we can take part in any order of life.

 

 

That is our position. Just like if I brush somebody’s shoes, that does not mean I am shoemaker. My position is the same. But to show how to do it… Just like a servant is doing.

The master is, “Oh, you cannot do. Just see.” Just like I show you sometimes how to mop. So I am not a mopper, but I am showing how to mop. So our position is like that. We do not belong to any varëa and äçrama. But we have to show these rascals.

 

 

 

 

Just like Dhruva Mahäräja. He, he was perfect Vaiñëava, but when he was king, he was fighting like anything. Not that, “Oh, I am now become Vaiñëava. I cannot kill.” What is this? He killed like anything. When the Yakñas attacked his kingdom, he was killing like anything then the Yakña-räja came and asked him to pardon this. He immediately accepted. So he wanted to give him some benediction, that “You are so great that simply on my request, you have stopped killing these rascals, Yakñas. So you can take some benediction from me.” He said, “That’s all right. Thank you. You give me the benediction that I may be a pure lover of Kåñëa. That’s all.”

This benediction he asked. Although he was so powerful and, the Yakña-räja, he could give him the wealth of the whole universe. But he made that, “Thank you very much. You give me this benediction that I may remain a pure devotee of Kåñëa.” This is Vaiñëava. He is doing everything, but his aim is to please Kåñëa. Similarly, even if we take to varëäçrama, we do not belong to any… Just like Kåñëa says, mayä såñöam. “I have inaugurated.” But Kåñëa has nothing to do with varëäçrama. Similarly, if we act as varëäçrama, still, we have nothing to do with the varëäçrama.

 

 

 

 

Hådayänanda: Prabhupäda, can you say something about the training for a brähmaëa.

 

Prabhupäda: Yes. They are satyaà çamaù damaù. He must be truthful, he must control the senses, control the mind… çamo damaù,… He must be tolerant. He should not be agitated in trifle matters. Satyaà çamo damaù çaucam. He must be always clean. Three times he must take bath at least. All the clothing, all, everything is clean. This is brahminical training. And then he must know all what is what, knowledge, and practical application, and firm faith in Kåñëa. This is brähmaëa.

 

 

Hådayänanda: So what kind of practical work could we engage them in?

 

 

Prabhupäda: They’ll be teaching. They’ll be all teachers.

 

Hådayänanda: Oh, they’ll be teachers.

 

Prabhupäda: Yes. Just like Droëäcärya. He was brähmaëa, but he was teaching military art to the Päëòavas. General teacher class will be the brähmaëas. It doesn’t matter what he’s teaching. But teaching, perfectly teaching, how to become a military man. Arjuna’s fighting was due to Droëäcärya. He learned it from Droëäcärya. He was a brähmaëa. But because he took the position of a teacher, he thought very perfectly. A brähmaëa should be expert in every kind of knowledge. If requires, he’ll become teacher. This is brähmaëa.

 

Hådayänanda: So brähmaëa can teach how to fight?

 

Prabhupäda: Yes. Brähmaëa means intelligent, brain. So in intelligent brain one can learn anything and teach anything.

 

Satsvarüpa: This is all very new.

Prabhupäda: Eh?

Satsvarüpa: This is very new. It seems there’ll be many difficulties. So we should try to start this school.